A difficult set of subjects that I very much vibed with. By the way, guess who else has a banner at Arch Madness? Kenny Williams, who played for UIC in either the Horizon League or the Mid-Con. The only possible link to the MVC - and it's a thin one - is that he is a pbp announcer for a current MVC team, but then the appropriate picture would be him with headphones on, and I don't think that's what made him a legend. I don't think Bryce Drew or Alec Peters should have a banner at Arch Madness either, but if these guys have one, then at least one of them should as well.
I do have a suggestion for Valpo fans who don't think Arch Madness is worth the trouble if Valpo isn't competitive: There's more to MVC basketball than Valpo. I promise, if I lived in Valpo instead of the St. Louis Metro area, I would still make it my business to go every year, because I would be guaranteed some quality basketball and chances for interacting with other MVC fans. As you said, this tournament is run extremely well. The best quarterfinal game I've seen in person in the past 8 years was 2023 Belmont vs. Indiana State. It was high quality basketball with plenty of awesome scoring plays and it went down to the wire. I've heard MVC veteran observers say it was the best quarterfinal game ever under Arch (last 30 years or so).
At any rate, this is how cope with Valpo not being very good overall so far in this conference - by loosening my parochial grip on my fanhood.
As to whether Valpo made a mistake, I should tell a few of my friends in the Horizon League think it absolutely was a mistake (they would probably express reluctance to welcome us back, just to add color to that question).
Thanks for putting yourself out there. Oh yeah, as for insufferable MVC fans, I do have vague feelings about the most prolific fanbases with respect to booing all fouls called against their beloved team (and Valpo has its fair share of such types as well). But I reserve my strongest disgust for a couple of UNI fans on social media whose attitude toward Valpo being in the conference rivals that of certain Butler fans back in 2008, if you know what I mean. Perhaps you are hearing the same kind of sentiment from SIU fans, I wouldn't know.
For what it's worth, I heard a lot of words of respect and complement from Drake fans, and maybe Bradley fans as I and the other Valpo fans I sat with left the Arena Saturday night. I try to pay no mind to fans who rage about Valpo being in the conference, because there's really nothing they can do about it.
I think you raised a lot of important issues in this podcast. It sounds to me like the Valley is having some buyer’s remorse about Valpo. They thought they were getting one thing and what they got hasn’t been what they counted on. I also think Valpo has always struggled, to some degree, with not really having a real fan base. Sure, people showed up when they were winning, but not many people in Northwest Indiana really have any kind of deep emotional tie to VU. And for a lot of people in the community, something about VU just rubs them the wrong way. There’s a disconnect between the university and the community. It was there when I was a student there 35 years ago, and it’s still there today. I can’t put my finger on it, but it’s there. And it’s hard to build something when you don’t have that fan base or that community support.
The truth is that VU was much more in its element (and at its level) when it was in a league with schools that were basically commuter schools—urban schools without big fan bases. The MVC is an odd fit for Valpo (and probably for UIC too). And despite being a very rugged, difficult league, it’s still a one-bid league. VU went from a situation where it could make the NCAA tournament six or seven years out of 10 to one where it might go once in a generation. It was a mistake. VU should leave.
I would really like to see a Midwestern-based private-school league made up of schools that may have stepped up too far—let’s say Valpo, Butler, DePaul, Evansville, Loyola, St. Louis—and others that are basically at the same level, like Detroit, St. Thomas, Bellarmine, Oral Roberts. Create a new league that’s competitive and makes sense for everyone involved.
Paul,
A difficult set of subjects that I very much vibed with. By the way, guess who else has a banner at Arch Madness? Kenny Williams, who played for UIC in either the Horizon League or the Mid-Con. The only possible link to the MVC - and it's a thin one - is that he is a pbp announcer for a current MVC team, but then the appropriate picture would be him with headphones on, and I don't think that's what made him a legend. I don't think Bryce Drew or Alec Peters should have a banner at Arch Madness either, but if these guys have one, then at least one of them should as well.
I do have a suggestion for Valpo fans who don't think Arch Madness is worth the trouble if Valpo isn't competitive: There's more to MVC basketball than Valpo. I promise, if I lived in Valpo instead of the St. Louis Metro area, I would still make it my business to go every year, because I would be guaranteed some quality basketball and chances for interacting with other MVC fans. As you said, this tournament is run extremely well. The best quarterfinal game I've seen in person in the past 8 years was 2023 Belmont vs. Indiana State. It was high quality basketball with plenty of awesome scoring plays and it went down to the wire. I've heard MVC veteran observers say it was the best quarterfinal game ever under Arch (last 30 years or so).
At any rate, this is how cope with Valpo not being very good overall so far in this conference - by loosening my parochial grip on my fanhood.
As to whether Valpo made a mistake, I should tell a few of my friends in the Horizon League think it absolutely was a mistake (they would probably express reluctance to welcome us back, just to add color to that question).
Thanks for putting yourself out there. Oh yeah, as for insufferable MVC fans, I do have vague feelings about the most prolific fanbases with respect to booing all fouls called against their beloved team (and Valpo has its fair share of such types as well). But I reserve my strongest disgust for a couple of UNI fans on social media whose attitude toward Valpo being in the conference rivals that of certain Butler fans back in 2008, if you know what I mean. Perhaps you are hearing the same kind of sentiment from SIU fans, I wouldn't know.
For what it's worth, I heard a lot of words of respect and complement from Drake fans, and maybe Bradley fans as I and the other Valpo fans I sat with left the Arena Saturday night. I try to pay no mind to fans who rage about Valpo being in the conference, because there's really nothing they can do about it.
I think you raised a lot of important issues in this podcast. It sounds to me like the Valley is having some buyer’s remorse about Valpo. They thought they were getting one thing and what they got hasn’t been what they counted on. I also think Valpo has always struggled, to some degree, with not really having a real fan base. Sure, people showed up when they were winning, but not many people in Northwest Indiana really have any kind of deep emotional tie to VU. And for a lot of people in the community, something about VU just rubs them the wrong way. There’s a disconnect between the university and the community. It was there when I was a student there 35 years ago, and it’s still there today. I can’t put my finger on it, but it’s there. And it’s hard to build something when you don’t have that fan base or that community support.
The truth is that VU was much more in its element (and at its level) when it was in a league with schools that were basically commuter schools—urban schools without big fan bases. The MVC is an odd fit for Valpo (and probably for UIC too). And despite being a very rugged, difficult league, it’s still a one-bid league. VU went from a situation where it could make the NCAA tournament six or seven years out of 10 to one where it might go once in a generation. It was a mistake. VU should leave.
I would really like to see a Midwestern-based private-school league made up of schools that may have stepped up too far—let’s say Valpo, Butler, DePaul, Evansville, Loyola, St. Louis—and others that are basically at the same level, like Detroit, St. Thomas, Bellarmine, Oral Roberts. Create a new league that’s competitive and makes sense for everyone involved.
Good stuff. Thanks. This guilted me into attending Valpo sporting events. I live in Washington state, but I need to do it.